WhoBuilt

Scaling and the Road to Human-Level AI

Jul 29, 2025· 41 min· 61K views·Watch on YouTube

Speaker

Anthropic co-founder Jared Kaplan explains how scaling shapes the road to human-level AI at a Y Combinator event, followed by a fireside chat with Diana and audience questions.

How model training and scaling work

Kaplan describes two training phases: pre-training, which teaches models patterns in text and multimodal data, and reinforcement learning, which encourages useful behaviors based on feedback. He says both phases show scaling laws: performance improves predictably as compute, data, and model size grow. He points to early results in pre-training and a Hex game study as evidence that scaling reinforcement learning can also improve performance.

Longer tasks and what human-level AI may need

Kaplan describes AI capability in terms of flexibility across domains and the length of tasks a system can complete. He cites METR’s finding that task horizons have been doubling roughly every seven months, and imagines systems eventually taking on work done by organizations or research communities. He says progress will also depend on organizational knowledge, memory for long tasks, better oversight for nuanced work, and capabilities beyond text, including robotics.

Advice for builders and possible applications

Kaplan advises builders to experiment with products that are not quite feasible yet, since model capabilities may improve enough to make them useful. He says AI can help speed its own integration into products, companies, and science, and points to software engineering as an early example of rapid adoption. He suggests exploring computer based work in fields such as finance and law, while noting that adoption also requires redesigning how businesses operate.

Claude 4, reliability, and human collaboration

In the fireside chat, Kaplan says Claude 4 improves coding agents’ ability to follow directions and produce better code, and adds memory that can help carry work across context windows. He expects models to take on larger tasks over time, while recognizing that they still make mistakes and need people to judge their work. He says human collaboration remains useful for difficult tasks, and that automation will expand as reliability improves and more tasks become acceptable at roughly 70 or 80 percent success.

Scaling limits, efficiency, and supervision

Kaplan says apparent failures of scaling laws have often reflected problems with training, architecture, or algorithms, and he would need substantial evidence before concluding that scaling had stopped working. He expects training and inference costs to fall through algorithmic and hardware efficiency, while demand for frontier capabilities may keep growing. For longer tasks, he sees AI systems providing detailed supervision as a way to make reinforcement learning more efficient; task creation can combine AI generated examples with human input.

Takeaways

  • Test ambitious product ideas at the edge of current model capabilities, because model improvements may make them workable.
  • Look for adoption opportunities in computer based work beyond software engineering, including finance and law.
  • Design AI workflows around task reliability: use human review where errors are costly and allow more autonomy where lower accuracy is acceptable.
  • Give models organizational context and persistent memory when work spans many steps or sessions.
  • Use AI generated tasks and supervisory feedback to expand reinforcement learning, while keeping humans involved for harder examples.

Mentioned in this talk

Search inside this talk

What was claimed 6

  • founded
    “Anthropic Co-founder Jared Kaplan”
    YouTube
    Verified3 sources· Talk, Web· archived
  • works at
    “many of the founders of Anthropic, whom I now work with”
    YouTube
    Unverified1 source· Talk
  • metric
    METR: The length of tasks AI models can do is doubling roughly every seven months
    “found yet another scaling trend”
    YouTube
    Unverified1 source· Talk
  • feature
    Claude: Can save and retrieve memories across context windows
    “begun to build into Claude 4”
    YouTube
    Unverified1 source· Talk
  • feature
    Claude: Can store and retrieve memories as files or records across context windows
    “store memories as files or records and retrieve them”
    YouTube
    Unverified1 source· Talk
  • feature
    Claude: Improved agent capabilities for coding, search, and other applications
    “improve the model's ability to act as an agent”
    YouTube
    Unverified1 source· Talk

Related talks